Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

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Contrarian
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Re: Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

Post by Contrarian » Tue Jul 09, 2019 11:18 pm

lakeland wrote:
Fri Jul 05, 2019 9:57 am
Contrarian wrote:
Thu Jul 04, 2019 9:42 pm
He's full of beef.
Con! A very on brand post for you. Hope everything is going well.
I mean, he literally only eats beef.... and he seems to create a lot of beef. The archetype of the cow features heavily in his life. Unsurprisingly he also chats bulls**t.

I'm well Lakeland. I miss the good old days of chat Xx

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workingmama
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Re: Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

Post by workingmama » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:25 am

Punkgirluk wrote:
Fri Jun 07, 2019 12:47 am

I don’t think however (and here I am in agreement with Miriam) that getting into an ideological debate is the way forward. There was a recent paper (I think by Reicher et al but I would need to check) on extremism which clearly showed that challenging people with extreme views on the basis of ideology or evidence was ineffective at best and potentially counterproductive.
When I challenge someone on their ideology, behavior, sexism, whatever, I'm not challenging them with the belief that I'll alter their views, I'm doing it for the bystanders, for the lurkers, for the quiet folks watching from the audience. The debate is the forum not to change the opposition's mind, but to give a different viewpoint, to protest, to make sure my side is heard. IMO.
Fail, fail again, fail better.

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miriam
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Re: Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

Post by miriam » Wed Jul 10, 2019 2:24 pm

workingmama wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:25 am
When I challenge someone on their ideology, behavior, sexism, whatever, I'm not challenging them with the belief that I'll alter their views, I'm doing it for the bystanders, for the lurkers, for the quiet folks watching from the audience. The debate is the forum not to change the opposition's mind, but to give a different viewpoint, to protest, to make sure my side is heard. IMO.
Very much this.

Although occasionally people with strong beliefs do find a means to question them. I'm mindful of people like Megan Phelps, who left the Westboro Baptist Church due to debate on Twitter and her message that we need to engage with those with abhorrent views, with questions and without an assumption of negative intent. So I genuinely admire anyone that can do that. The difficulty for me is that such beliefs are so numerous, so vocal and so toxic to engage with on social media, that it is easy to run out of energy or to feel like those conversations have a negative impact on your mood or quality of life. Which is why I don't have as much energy to invest in such debate any more.

Plus we are really quite a protected bubble here, as it is a professional networking site, and our guidance has been set up to make the space feel inclusive for anyone with an interest in our profession. It probably isn't the place to raise potentially offensive beliefs for debate, except for threads like this where there is a psychology element. I wouldn't allow sexism, racism or other overt prejudice to be expressed here, for example.
Miriam

See my blog at http://clinpsyeye.wordpress.com

Punkgirluk
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Re: Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

Post by Punkgirluk » Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:41 pm

Thank you Workingmama. That is a very useful alternative way of thinking about contentious issues that hadn’t occurred to me previously (despite now seeming really quite obvious 🤔). I will think more on this but I can see that considering it like this may help to prevent that “I’m banging my head on a brick wall here....” feeling which I so often get debating on social media and which often ends with me just giving up in despair!

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Re: Jordan Peterson - why do practitioners not like him?

Post by PinkFreud19 » Thu Jul 11, 2019 9:25 am

Punkgirluk wrote:
Wed Jul 10, 2019 10:41 pm
Thank you Workingmama. That is a very useful alternative way of thinking about contentious issues that hadn’t occurred to me previously (despite now seeming really quite obvious 🤔). I will think more on this but I can see that considering it like this may help to prevent that “I’m banging my head on a brick wall here....” feeling which I so often get debating on social media and which often ends with me just giving up in despair!
Just a little anecdote to add to this. I subscribe to the BBC on Youtube, and I'm not sure if anyone here has noticed, but the BBC YouTube comments section is a cesspit of the far-right (and I do not use the term far-right lightly). Any BBC videos about feminism are not just received with critical comments, but comments that are disturbingly misogynistic in nature, with implications that women do not deserve equal rights.

So anyway, there was a comments section about Brexit that particularly annoyed me; it was a fair and balanced video from the BBC about how much the UK actually pays into the EU. The comments were the usual splurge of "the BBC are a propaganda machine for remain" and "the EU are oppressive neoliberalists". I decided to make a comment to challenge some of these irrational ideas. To my surprise, I noticed several months later that my comment had been the most liked comment on the video, despite many of the second and third most liked comments being the normal right-wing drivel. Even amongst crucibles of far-right nonsense, my ideas were still able to spread and resonate and hold others to account.

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